Roger, Rick, All,

I can not remember much about the upper shroud chainplates which run up through the toe rail; or how the deck to hull joint is constructed for that matter, but here are a few pictures I took from my old 1976 model Rhodes 22.  The previous owner cut a section of the cabin liner out with a series of drilled holes. The chainplate consisted of two tangs, crossed and bolted together. I never investigated them any more than making sure the nuts were tight. But looking back at the pictures now, I can't figure out where the heads of the bolts were, but guess they were behind the rub rail. (?) I have never taken the rub rail off any of the three Rhodes 22s I've owned.

Todd T




Shroud 1.JPG

Shroud 2.JPG

On Fri, Oct 27, 2023 at 6:38 PM ROGER PIHLAJA <roger_pihlaja at msn.com> wrote:

> Rick,
>
> Tell us more about how one of the upper side stay chainplates failed
> suddenly and without warning.  I agree it’s hard to inspect the way it’s
> glassed in.  However, if the FRP substrate failed, I would expect it would
> get “mushy” first.  Similarly, if the stainless steel chainplate itself
> failed, I would expect it to gradually get weaker as the pitting and cracks
> extended.  Either mechanism would cause a situation wherein you would have
> issues with maintaining the shroud tension.  After every sail, the shroud
> would be loose.  Since you claim the failure happened suddenly without
> warning, please tell us what happened.
>
> Roger Pihlaja
> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> > On Oct 27, 2023, at 4:44 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA <Roger_Pihlaja at msn.com>
> wrote:
> >
> > Rick,
> >
> > What yelling?  You start the engine.  While it’s warming up, you walk to
> the bow, and snag the anchor rode downstream of the carabiner with a boat
> hook. You motor slowly forward while pulling in the anchor rode hand over
> hand over the railing.  Note that you haven’t touched the bow cleat or the
> carabiner.  When the anchor is aboard, you go and redeploy.  No muss, no
> fuss.  I am just claiming that my technique makes it less likely the anchor
> is going to drag.  Often, your suggested options of going someplace else or
> going to shore are not available.  The Rhodes 22 has the advantage of
> shallow draft and can often be anchored in a corner of the harbor where the
> big boats can’t go.  We all have a vision of being alone in a pristine
> anchorage.  But, that’s often not the reality.  Have you actually done much
> anchoring out?  What do you propose to do if you’re not willing to anchor
> in close quarters?  Remember, there are no slips available and it’s too
> late to go somewhere else.
> >
> > Roger Pihlaja
> > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium
> > Sent from my iPhone
> >
> >> On Oct 27, 2023, at 4:19 PM, Rick Lange <sloopblueheron at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >>
> >> Roger,
> >>
> >> If you wake up dragging, it is likely you will need to quickly redeploy.
> >> That's not easily and safely done in the dark with your anchor tackle
> >> complications.  And any "optimizing" that ignores emergencies just
> leads to
> >> a short life--and a lot of yelling.
> >>
> >> I am not suggesting an all chain rode.  I am saying you need a 20' chain
> >> between anchor and rope rode, as you have.  The rope should be no less
> than
> >> 7 times longer than the water depth.  If you can't find a spot that has
> >> enough room, go to shore or to another anchorage.  Good seamanship is
> not
> >> squeezing in.
> >>
> >> One of the few faults with the R22 is that the chain plates cannot be
> >> visually inspected.  Some on this list have opened inspection holes in
> the
> >> cabin inside walls to make inspection possible.  The lower stays did
> their
> >> backup job fine, however, reattaching the plate and repairing the hull
> was
> >> expensive.
> >>
> >> I ran out of gas trying to beat a storm that was not predicted.  The
> lesson
> >> learned was to always carry a full reserve tank on the open lake.
> >>
> >> Regards,
> >>
> >> Rick Lange
> >>
> >>
> >>>> On Fri, Oct 27, 2023 at 1:29 PM ROGER PIHLAJA <roger_pihlaja at msn.com>
> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Rick,
> >>>
> >>> For those of us that actually stay overnight at anchor, there are two
> >>> major issues we worry about:
> >>> 1: Is my anchor going to drag?
> >>> 2: If the wind or current shifts, is my swing circle going to interfere
> >>> with the boats anchored around me?
> >>>
> >>> With a given anchor type and anchor rode configuration, the best way to
> >>> reduce the chance of dragging anchor is to increase the scope ratio.
> With
> >>> a small boat, like a Rhodes 22, an all chain anchor rode is simply too
> >>> heavy to be a practical option.  I use a boat length of chain
> connected to
> >>> 150 ft of 3/8 inch diameter three strand nylon rode.
> >>>
> >>> The best way to assure your swing circle isn’t going to interfere with
> >>> other boats is to make your swing radius as small as possible, with an
> >>> acceptable scope ratio.  Why would I want to make my swing radius
> bigger?
> >>> The reality of small sailboat cruising is that we tend to arrive at an
> >>> anchorage late in the day.  By this time, the power boats have already
> >>> dropped their hooks for the evening.  We often have to find a place
> among
> >>> the boats that are already in place and the newcomer always has to
> yield
> >>> right of way.  Having a small swing radius lets us squeeze in where
> most
> >>> boats could not.
> >>>
> >>> My suggested anchoring technique enables one or the other of these
> issues
> >>> to be optimized.  All other anchoring scenarios put together make up a
> very
> >>> small % of the total use of your anchor.  I’m glad you were able to
> keep
> >>> your boat off the rocks by emergency anchoring.  But, this scenario has
> >>> very little to do with normal cruising.  Good seamanship would dictate
> that
> >>> you inspect your rigging and pay attention to your fuel level so you
> don’t
> >>> have to emergency anchor.  But, those are entirely separate issues.
> >>>
> >>> Roger Pihlaja
> >>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium
> >>>
> >>> Sent from my iPhone
> >>>
> >>>
>