Todd,
Lithium reacts with water to give lithium hydroxide, hydrogen gas, and lots of heat. Hydrogen is very flammable and lithium hydroxide is very alkaline and corrosive. But, the stored electrical energy in the battery is an issue as well. As the battery is destroyed, that energy doesn’t just disappear. It ends up as heat.
Roger Pihlaja
S/V Dynamic Equilibrium
Sent from my iPhone
> On Feb 22, 2022, at 1:52 PM, Todd Tavares <tavares0947 at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Roger,
>> Does a lithium fire create its own oxygen or combustible oxides, like
> magnesium?
>> Todd T.
>>> On Mon, Feb 21, 2022, 3:52 PM ROGER PIHLAJA <roger_pihlaja at msn.com> wrote:
>>>> Mark,
>>>> You make a good point about the rest of the vehicles on board the ship.
>> However, I noticed that throughout this event, the color of the smoke
>> coming from the ship was white. This color smoke is characteristic of
>> lithium fires. Whereas, if hydrocarbons, like gasoline, fuel oil, or tires
>> were burning, particularly in a depleted oxygen environment, the smoke
>> would be black. The lithium fires may have raised the interior temperature
>> so high; that, the carbon particles in the black hydrocarbon smoke are
>> being completely combusted to white ash particles, producing white smoke.
>> This would be consistent with the steel outer hull skin panels being
>> destroyed.
>>>> Roger Pihlaja
>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium
>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>> On Feb 21, 2022, at 2:13 PM, Mark Whipple <mark at whipplefamily.com>
>> wrote:
>>>>>> I agree that it's highly probable that there are EV vehicles with
>> lithium
>>> batteries among the nearly 4,000 vehicles on board, but it's a good bet
>>> there are also many conventionally powered vehicles with gasoline in the
>>> tanks. Once the rubber and plastic parts on any car ignite it can be
>>> difficult to extinguish - especially if a number of vehicles become
>>> enflamed. I'm going to guess it will be months or years before the causes
>>> of the fire are identified and publicized - if the ship actually makes it
>>> to a port to be examined.
>>>>>> Mark
>>>>>> Boston, MA
>>>>>> 2000 R22 *Luna Mia*
>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Feb 21, 2022 at 8:33 AM ROGER PIHLAJA <roger_pihlaja at msn.com>
>> wrote:
>>>>>>>> Hi All,
>>>>>>>> Almost 6 days after the fire started, the M/V Felicity Ace is still
>>>> ablaze, unmanned, and adrift in the Atlantic Ocean. Lithium battery
>> fires
>>>> burn much hotter vs “ordinary” hydrocarbon fires. In the attached
>> picture,
>>>> you can see a fire fighting ship attempting to cool the hull by spraying
>>>> water on it. But, ~1/4 of the exterior steel skin, just aft of
>> amidships,
>>>> has been already been burned away leaving only the underlying steel
>>>> substructure and you can see lots of other steel skin plating blackened
>> and
>>>> ready to fail. Firefighters cannot go on board because of the heat and
>>>> toxic fumes given off by the burning Lithium batteries. All they can
>> do is
>>>> spray water on the outside of the ship in the hope of cooling it off.
>> The
>>>> only way I can think of extinguishing this fire would be to pump massive
>>>> amounts of dry chemical fire extinguishing media through out the ship
>> and
>>>> smother the flames. Then, you might have to wait weeks for the whole
>> mess
>>>> to cool off. I think they are rushing an ocean tug to the scene. But,
>> the
>>>> M/V Felicity Ace is too big to put in to any port in Azores Islands.
>> So,
>>>> they would have to tow it someplace like Portugal? There might be an
>> issue
>>>> getting any port to accept a burning ship!
>>>>>>>> Frankly, it’s a miracle the fuel tanks haven’t gone up yet!
>>>>>>>> With so much of the skin of the hull burned away, it’s only a matter of
>>>> time before a storm swamps and sinks her.
>>>>>>>> Remember, these are the supposedly “safer” batteries installed in EV’s.
>>>> There are starting to be more and more media stories about the role of
>> the
>>>> Lithium batteries in this fire.
>>>>>>>> [cid:image003.jpg at 01D826FD.9A2384B0]
>>>>>>>> Roger Pihlaja
>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium
>>>>>>>> Sent from Mail<
>>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgo.microsoft.com%2Ffwlink%2F%3FLinkId%3D550986&data=04%7C01%7C%7C3fbef99147ec4e228b4a08d9f6347107%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637811527375318819%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=tWbdWS8jsO085eRHALFIV%2FO6PIP5uwEk6AawMVuEUQc%3D&reserved=0>
>> for Windows
>>>>>>>> From: ROGER PIHLAJA<mailto:Roger_Pihlaja at msn.com>
>>>> Sent: Thursday, February 17, 2022 8:12 AM
>>>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List<mailto:rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
>>>> Subject: An Ongoing Lithium Battery Fire At Sea?
>>>>>>>> Hi All,
>>>>>>>> On February 10, 2022; the 656 ft LOA car carrier cargo ship, the M/V
>>>> Felicity Ace, departed from Emden, Germany with a cargo of nearly 4000
>> new
>>>> Porsches and VW’s. The Felicity Ace was bound for Davisville, Rhode
>> Island
>>>> and was due to arrive on February 23, 2022. On February 16th, the
>> Felicity
>>>> Ace sent out a distress signal after a fire broke out in the cargo
>> hold. A
>>>> Portuguese navy patrol boat and 4 other merchant vessels responded to
>> the
>>>> distress call. All 22 crew members have been rescued. But, the vessel
>> is
>>>> still on fire and adrift in the Atlantic Ocean near the Azores Islands.
>>>> The M/V Felicity Ace was built in 2005 as a dedicated car carrier and
>> has
>>>> modern fire suppression systems. The cause of the fire is still under
>>>> investigation and there is little information available as yet. But,
>> there
>>>> were certainly a large number of Lithium battery EV’s among the cargo.
>> No
>>>> matter how the fire started, the fact that the onboard fire suppression
>>>> systems have been unable to extinguish it is suspicious. Hopefully,
>> they
>>>> will somehow get the fire under control before the vessel sinks or we
>> may
>>>> never find out what happened.
>>>>>>>> Stay tuned, this could turn into a major Lithium battery EV safety
>> scandal!
>>>>>>>> Roger Pihlaja
>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium
>>>>>>>> Sent from Mail<
>>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgo.microsoft.com%2Ffwlink%2F%3FLinkId%3D550986&data=04%7C01%7C%7C3fbef99147ec4e228b4a08d9f6347107%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637811527375318819%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=tWbdWS8jsO085eRHALFIV%2FO6PIP5uwEk6AawMVuEUQc%3D&reserved=0>
>> for Windows
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>>>>>>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Frhodes22.org%2Fpipermail%2Frhodes22-list%2Fattachments%2F20220221%2Fe82a1410%2Fattachment.jpg&data=04%7C01%7C%7C3fbef99147ec4e228b4a08d9f6347107%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637811527375318819%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=IKpDONhianZh2w2ybDILJFrDMf1qrKUsawmW0sMy%2BfA%3D&reserved=0>>>>>>>>>>>
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